Choosing Forgiveness Webinar

So, Kaleb, our topic today is on choosing forgiveness which judging from the response, the registration, the questions that have been texted and emailed, this is an important topic. Yeah. Scripture is filled with it. Forgiveness is very near and dear to the Scriptures. 

Christ, in his Lord’s Prayer, says, “Forgive us our debts as we forgive those who are indebted to us.” And the title we chose is intentional. We talk about choosing forgiveness with the thought that often we get into this place of knowing we should and maybe having motivation to. But how? What does it look like? Yeah. So hopefully there’s a heart of practicality with this discussion today. What is forgiveness, what it is not. But let’s just start, Kaleb, with that whole verb, choosing. Is there a choice involved with forgiveness? 

Certainly. It’s not just something that happens. And I would say more than a choice, but ongoing choices. And just like you introduced the topic, it is both a decision that we make and an ongoing process of making many decisions of walking the path of forgiveness. And so, I do think the title of choosing forgiveness fits that. So, there’s the initial choice but the ongoing as well. Yeah. So, I’m getting ahead of us a little bit. Our heart today is to talk a little bit definitionally. 

We’ll go pretty quickly through that because again, I think this is something that maybe we know needs to happen, but then we want to get into some of those deeper elements of how we do it. And then we’ll end with a discussion on reconciliation versus forgiveness, because they are two different things that came up often in the questions and come up often in discussions. What does it mean to not just forgive but to reconcile, and is that even possible? Yeah.  

So, let’s jump right into this whole idea of forgiveness. We have the definition, right? Yeah. Releasing what is owed to us by those who have done wrong against us. Some terms might be letting go or sending away. We think about a debt that’s due. Perhaps an offense or a hurt that’s been done to us. Kaleb with just this definitionally speaking, what stands out or what’s important for us to think about when considering this concept of forgiveness? 

What is forgiveness? So, first, one of the things that I think about is we live in a culture that is actually quick to seek to carry out vengeance and slow to forgive. And I think we live in a culture where justice is really important, but by justice we almost mean vengeance. Correct. And that there is a way of forgiveness possible because of Christ. We sense that there’s a debt. And think about buying a house. There’s a mortgage and there’s a payment that I can’t make. It’s beyond my ability to pay it, and so there’s a significant debt. And so, forgiveness when there’s an offense that says they’re wrong and a key piece is that we can define wrongs in any way. 

Again, in our culture it feels like I’m an irritant and all of a sudden that becomes an offense, and we’re like, wait a second. Forgiveness is actually for something that is sin, hurt, or an offense. It’s not just a mistake and a shortcoming that we all have. Yeah. And we inherently do. That’s a key piece, right? Because there’s a perception versus a reality. And so, part of entering into this whole discussion is to realize that we’re saying forgiveness comes in when an offense is real not just perceived. That enters a little bit of a different category at times. 

Maybe more of a conversation or a dialogue or something like that. There’s the actual reality of offense that we have to think through. Yep. And I think the other thing is just thinking about what forgiveness is, the hopelessness that the more the more that pain consumes us, the more it will control us. Yeah. And forgiveness provides a way whereby we can be released. Not an easy way. It’s costly as we’ll talk about, but release from that debt, from that pain.  

I want to draw a contrast, too. I think it’s on the next slide, we have a couple of verses. Yeah. So, if you look at that Colossians one. Ephesians and Colossians are similar. But that Colossians one brings in this idea of forbearance. Forbearing one another and forgiving one another, whereas the Ephesian one just leaves that off a little bit. But just to go back to your earlier point, there are times when we go through life and they are calling us to forbear, which is put up with the annoyances or irritants or things that you just don’t want to tolerate. Use the example of taking a road trip with your kids. A long road trip. Forbearance takes place over time, which is different than forgiveness. 

And I think part of the how-to of forgiveness or stepping into it is being able to separate that out a little bit. Okay this is a case where I need to forbear and put up with versus this is a case where there has been an offense. Yeah. And that leads into the category of forgiveness. Yeah, that’s very well stated, Arlan. I don’t know if I have much to add, but I think that distinction is a helpful one. And that Christ calls us to, forbear. Think about how he ongoingly forbears with us. 

Yeah. In our inability to engage in a way that we would like to. Yeah. And you bring that to Christ, right? Yeah. Both of these verses have vertical versus horizontal forgiveness. Speak into that just a little bit, what we mean by vertical versus horizontal. 

Yeah. So, first Jesus certainly engages this in the Gospels as he talks about the servant who was forgiven so much and then went out and wouldn’t forgive a fellow servant. But you have this recognition of how much we have been forgiven back to the debt that we could not pay. 

And I think as believers, this is what grounds us in the ability to forgive. I think about that, Arlan. Without the grounding of the cross, forgiveness becomes something I just let go of. Yeah. You know what I’m saying? Yeah. What I just let go, but actually the grounding of the cross says this matters. Yeah. And I think the ability to do it rests on our cooperation with the forgiveness we’ve received. Which is, again, hopeful in the midst of the really hard work that forgiveness is ongoing. So, there is that deep correlation between vertical and horizontal. 

The vertical makes the horizontal possible, or it has to. I remember talking to an individual once, and two things always come up. Forgiveness is an easy concept. I think that’s a famous quote, right? Forgiveness is an easy concept until you have something to forgive somebody for, right? Yeah. Then it becomes really in your face. But the other, what this individual said is forgiveness becomes possible when you realize how much you’ve been forgiven. Which is what we’ve been saying. And it was interesting just to hear him really press into that. 

Which really pushes us to ground ourselves in the cross, the atonement, and forgiveness that we’ve received from God via Christ. If we can’t get that really firmly into our mindset, it will become just practice. Yeah. But having that propels us into moving towards forgiveness. Yes. And I think outside of that, we’re unable to. It is empowered by him and through him that we’re able to forgive. Yeah. And just as we referenced earlier, Christ in the Sermon on the Mount and in the Lord’s Prayer says, “Forgive.” 

It’s part of that very precious real estate of the Lord’s Prayer. Not many words, but that’s right in the center of it. “Forgive us our debts as we forgive those who are in debt to us.” So, it’s near and dear to the Father’s heart. Yeah. So, let’s walk into a little bit more of the how to then. 

You can say forgiveness is a choice, a step. We flip the switch, and we move to forgiveness. And it’s all gone. And the reality is it’s really hard and difficult more of a process. There are steps. There are stages. So, this slide lays out four steps to think about. Kaleb, walk into it wherever you want to go. What does forgiveness probably look like more in reality. 

So, the first is to recall the offense, which I think is interesting in itself, Arlan, because oftentimes in the process of forgiveness, that’s sometimes what we’re trying not to do. And so, I think there’s a way in which we are recalling the offense as we talked about differentiating an offense from something I need to forbear. 

But also, this sense as you think about God in the Old Testament with the children of Israel, he asked them to remember. Not recall how horrible Pharaoh was but remember that you were in slavery. And so there is a sense that there’s a calling back. I heard a term somewhere about redemptive remembering. 

Meaning it’s the way that we recall or how we recall the offense. It’s not rehearsing it over and over, which is part of the process of us continuing to let go. But it’s recalling, yes, this did happen. It does matter, but I think in the redemptive recalling, one of the things that was talked about is the need for us to recognize God is there. 

Yeah. And his ability to work through it. So, recalling the offense. You have to recall it to be able to step into it, right? Once we recall it, once we bring it up in a redemptive way or just bringing it back up and avoid the rumination. Because that’s the ditch that you can fall in at that point. Recalling it can be something that just drags us down. But we’re recalling it to move towards the next step and that is extending grace.  

So, speak about that. What does that mean, or how would you classify that? Or maybe, there’s an empathy piece of that. Part of it is as we think about extending grace is when did you receive grace? When I deserved it? Yeah. I’d still be waiting for grace. And so, I think the first thing is recognizing that it goes back to us with God and that we receive grace not when we deserve it. Otherwise, it wouldn’t be grace.  

But there is this sense that our tendency as humans is to respond in kind and return in kind. I’m hurt so I’m going to hurt back. And this step of extending grace is about us recognizing that we all don’t deserve grace and receive it. Yeah. And how do I empathize or get to the place of not saying it’s okay. 

Grace is not saying it’s okay, actually. Otherwise, there wouldn’t be a need for grace. But it’s recognizing that must be a difficult thing to be at a place where I’m hurting someone else, and that they also likely engaged it out of a place of hurt. Empathizing by nature is like putting yourself in another’s shoes. And so there is an aspect of where what you’re saying is can we realize our common need for grace? How much we need that and appreciate that and then be willing to step into that extension with others.  

Now are there ways to help do that? You often work with couples, right? So, you’re working with a couple that’s walking through forgiveness. How do you encourage or help move someone to a place of empathizing with each other? Yeah. I know I’ve heard things like journaling are helpful. Or like putting yourself in their shoes and trying to see things from their perspective and putting it down on paper can be a healthy way to build empathy.  

One of the things about recalling the offense is also working through the hurt associated with the offense. Because it’s one thing for us to say, “Oh, extend grace, that’s nice” but in the midst of pain, that is nearly impossible to do. And so there is a process of journaling through the actual pain and hurt, and the rawness of what has happened that is not right. Therefore, it’s an offense. To get to a place where you’re able to see things and to be able to recognize and begin to look at the hurt from a different angle may be difficult. Actually, it’s interesting the way our brain works. When we’re in the midst of pain, our ability to see is very narrow, and that’s true for all of us. And so there is a need to work through that to get to a place of extending grace. Which goes with recalling the offense. 

So, there is an element of healthy, redemptive recalling that pain, but move it into a place for the purpose of grace extension, debt release, and forgiveness. Yep, so this third step is releasing the debt. Again, how does that tie in with extending grace or releasing the debt, or any thoughts on that middle step, and then we’ll go into the holding on and what that means to hold on. Yeah. So, as we think about releasing debt, my mind goes back to financial debt, right? I no longer hold it over. When my debt is paid off in Christ, our debt has been paid fully so that we are released, and we’re free, and we’re no longer seen through the reality of us being in debt. And so, releasing the debt is no longer holding over someone that ill will or intent but actually having a sense of goodwill and a desire for healing on their part. 

Now, we can’t do that, right? That’s theirs, and we’ll talk more about that. But it is releasing the debt. How does that quote go? Unforgiveness is like drinking poison and expecting the other person to die. Yeah. Because you hold onto that. Yeah. I’ve heard that quote before. So, we’re going to flip that, in verse four, it talks about holding on to forgiveness. Yeah. Which I think in some ways this is a key principle, and we’ll get into a little bit more the next slide. But we can think it’s like that switch we flipped, that all of a sudden, it’s done, and it should never come back up. But there’s a reality that this is a process that involves continually moving to a place of forgiveness with an offense that’s happened.  

Yeah, which I think is so hard, and I think the need to come back, to hold on, to cling to the truth of the cross as believers that forgiveness is possible because of the cooperation with God, and that we’re continually coming back to this reality, that it is through him that we able we’re able to hold on to forgiveness, and the cross covers what our feelings can’t. 

Our feelings sometimes are just not in a place to be able to say that it feels like I’ve forgiven them. And we come back to the truth that forgiveness is possible in cooperation with Christ through the cross regardless of what I feel. Sure. And again, that it’s not a one and done. Obviously the more severe the offense, the more difficult it is. Yes. Absolutely but sometimes you contrast it. If you don’t do this, then you’re saying, “I’m going to stay in a place of hurt. I’m going to stay in a place of being controlled by that situation, that incident,” versus the decision to say, “I’m going to move towards a place of healing.” 

So maybe another lens to look at is in the next slide where it speaks into this thought of the difference between decisional forgiveness and emotional forgiveness. Yeah. Again, these dovetail together, but speak about that, Kaleb. We’re almost pulling it out into two different places. There’s the logical decision-based portion of it, and then the emotional feelings side of forgiveness. How do these interact back and forth, or what does this look like as we walk into it?  

So, the decisional, as it shares on the slide there, is it’s a choice. It brings willingness to the process of forgiving. And that I am deciding to walk on this path. And it can happen at a point in time, and it leads to the process of emotional forgiveness. Because what we would say is that when you make the decision to forgive, you still need to process through what that actually means. 

We can go into two ditches with this, right? On one hand we can be overly positive, deny feelings, and say, “I’m forgiven,” but not live in reality of the cost of forgiveness and what actually forgiveness means. Because hurt changes us. But on the other hand, we can obviously get caught up in all emotions, and it’s just based on emotion. 

So, the emotional is an ongoing process because I think the thing that’s helpful, Arlan, is for us to remember there’s been an offense, but then there are also implications or impacts of that offense. Now as a result of someone hurting me it’s affected my sleep. It’s affected my spiritual walk. There are ripple effects. There is an ongoing process of wrestling with the impact of that offense. Does that make sense? That’s not a one point in time. It may be when you see that person, or it may be at a certain location, and some of these move into trauma, which I think we’ll talk about eventually. That is different than working through difficult emotions that come up. So severe offense, a traumatic offense, is a different category which we can get into. But just before we leave this slide, does decisional forgiveness always have to precede emotional forgiveness, or is that too simplistic of a decision? 

I really don’t know the answer to that, Kaleb. I think it goes back to no one is forcing you into forgiveness. Yeah. God does not force us into a process of forgiveness. It wasn’t like Christ or God was forced into forgiving us. No. And so, I think forgiveness is a choice we have to make. And yes, I think once we open ourselves up to that choice then we begin to process through what that means. I often think about Christ in the Garden of Gethsemane when he wrestled with the reality of the cost of forgiveness. 

Now that’s way beyond what we will ever experience. But I think it speaks to that emotional part to say he was fully man and fully God. He had already decided, right? And then he wrestled through prayer in the Garden of Gethsemane of what forgiveness actually means. The cost of forgiveness. Yeah.  And you’ve said it now multiple times, and I just don’t want it to ever be unsaid that what we’re talking about here is extremely difficult. And depending on the severity of situations we can run the risk of making it overly simplistic. 

And we can run the risk on the other side of making it impossible. But you want to provide help to say, okay, this is how we move towards it. There is an aspect of it, though, too, that we make it overly simple, like some people are very quick to forgive but is that because there’s denial going on in the back? 

And they don’t recall the offense. They just move on, and yet in reality what’s going on deeply internal is probably not true forgiveness. It’s just masking or ignoring and not making a big deal, when the reality is relationship work like this is hard work. Yeah. I’m not sure in those cases, Arlan, but as the first slide talked about forgiveness, there’s a debt. Yeah. There’s an offense. There’s pain as a result of that hurt. 

And what do we do with that hurt? Where do we go with that hurt? And I think it’s living in light of the reality of that hurt, and then the emotions that come as a result of that hurt. And we can’t process through what we don’t own. Yeah. What we don’t like. And so, my feelings as a result of that pain are mine to own and to process through. 

And to me, if we don’t recall the offense and understand the pain then it also inhibits the processing through and releasing to the reality of what that offense meant. Yeah. It matters. So, we’ll dwell on this next slide just a little bit. 

But we have five statements here that sometimes can be helpful in definitions is to say what something is and is not. Yeah. So, in all of these situations, we’re talking about horizontal forgiveness, just to be clear, right? Horizontal forgiveness and where forgiveness is not these things, right? 

So, the first one says, “Forgiveness is not dependent upon an apology.” Yeah. Speak into that. Yeah … it speaks a little bit about who initiates, right? Who’s the initiator in the situation? Yeah. So, a couple things come to mind. One is it’s not uncommon that there are situations where individuals are seeking to forgive someone who has even passed away, right? We would say if forgiveness is dependent on apology then there’s no opportunity to actually step into the forgiveness process. 

And also, my mind also goes to Christ when he’s on the cross. He cries out, “Forgive them for they know not what they do.” And so, I think there’s this sense that forgiveness is not dependent on someone else acknowledging that was wrong. Because sometimes in some cases, particularly in abusive situations or in traumatic situations, there may not be that. 

But I think the freedom and the hope is, Arlan, that if the other party is not going to apologize, there’s still opportunity to be released from that. Yeah. That forgiveness is possible. And I think the last portion here is that we’ll talk about the difference between forgiveness and reconciliation, right? 

Yeah. And that’s a little bit where this comes into, right? Yeah. We’re not talking about reconciliation in a relationship that’s exists as if there was nothing or moves to a place of health that way. We’re talking about just forgiveness- … itself. Which is an individual’s responsibility to step into regardless of the other person’s actions. 

We can only to some extent control our own actions really. And so, if we make it that we will step in when someone else does certain things, we are then still remaining hostage to other people’s actions. We’re dependent on them. Yeah. But the second piece that goes with that, though, is if we forgive, do we deny the seriousness of the offense? So how do you respond to someone that says, “Hey I’m not going to let go of that because as soon as I let go of that it’s like it never happened,” and they realize how much it hurt. Do they realize how much? Yeah.  

And this is probably unfortunately so real in so many cases where we are bearing the hurt, and the other person maybe has no idea. Yes. Oh. They’re oblivious. Yes. Perhaps intentionally, which is so malicious.  Yeah. But that’s often just because they don’t even realize it. So how do we step into this idea? Because we’re not trying to pretend it never happened. It’s a real thing. 

But you said something earlier about how we have to own our pain to be able to process through it. Or that’s what I heard you say. Does that apply here a little bit too? Yeah. I’m not sure where you’re going with that. My mind again goes to the cross of Christ Arlan, and forgiveness, denying the seriousness of the offense. No, I would actually say it validates that it matters. If you think about us as believers and that God created us in the image of God. And that means that when someone has sinned against the bearer of the image of God, they have sinned against God. 

Yeah. It is transcendent by consequence, and that’s why it is so hard and so serious. That it takes the cross of Christ. Now, it isn’t that forgiveness without the cross of Christ doesn’t matter. No, this actually matters greatly. And it may not be that serious if I sin against you. Yeah … you know what? I think it’s all that serious. But I think you’re able to process it. Forgiveness is not the same thing as denying it. It actually is saying, “No, this does matter.” I just want to repeat what I heard. 

I think it’s a critical point. We can do disservice to this whole concept of forgiveness by not being willing to have some of those hard conversations with someone that says, “Do you realize that when you did this or when this happened, that really offended me,” or “That really hurt me.” 

But we do it in a way that we’re not doing it to hold it over somebody, or we’re not doing it to get at somebody or put ourselves up above somebody or say, “Look what I have on top of you.” No, this is the seriousness of relational hurt that God takes extremely seriously. 

Yeah, and I’m bringing that out because I want you to know then that I’ve released that I’ve forgiven that. Yeah. But there is potentially a little bit of encouraging someone else or helping someone else as you walk through these relationship difficulties with them. 

Yep. I was just thinking as you were talking about this sense that there’s another part to this. I think we can both seek forgiveness and also seek justice. We can seek to live justly and humbly, as Micah, would say, and also forgive. 

And I think part of denying the seriousness of offense isn’t saying we want justice and it’s not that we just release it and anything’s okay. Yeah. Does that make sense? Yeah. Oh, no, actually it doesn’t make it okay. We’re turning it over to God. Yeah. To the foot of the cross. We’re resting and we can both forgive because of cooperation with him, while also living justly in this life. 

It’s just that I’m not carrying out vengeance. Yeah. But I’m also living justly in the sense that I’m acknowledging that there was offense. Yes. Yeah. Exactly. That’s really good. Yes. So again, maybe we just answered three right in there. Forgiveness is not forgetting the offense. Yeah, but let’s dwell on that word of forgetting. Yeah. We talked about that before a little bit. That’s the hold on piece. Yeah. Where it doesn’t mean that when we forgive, it will just totally disappear and never come back up, unfortunately. Yeah, and I’m smiling because I hate that forgive and forget. 

Sometimes we say that. I don’t know if you’ve heard that. Oh, yeah. Forgive and forget. Oh, yeah. That is the antithesis of forgiveness. In fact, in some cases it would be unwise to forget. But it’s how we remember that matters. Yeah. It’s how we remember, and so we can’t forget. Our brains are actually the way we learn and engage. Now, it is a releasing and a constant releasing, but that doesn’t mean forgetting and just wiping my memory of that. Because again, I think this goes into the next one to say to forget when there’s a not reconciliation would be really unwise. 

Yeah. Because there are times when offense will sever a relationship that is only going to be as repairable as reconciliation is possible and maybe will never go back to normal, right? Yeah. Just because it can never fully go back to normal. So, I think when we say forgive and forget and pretend like it never happened, that’s probably not the right way to actually look at it. It’s more like we forgive and we choose to move to a place of I am not holding on to that. 

I’m putting that under the forgiveness of the cross. Into that place of surrender there. Yeah. Can I mention something? So, one of the things that come up here for me too, Arlan, about forgetting an offense is that sometimes individuals struggle to release an offense, not because of their inability to move through forgiveness, but because it’s trauma. 

Yeah. And I think understanding for individuals who are in the midst of this have been offended to knowing the difference from trauma, which overwhelms the system we’d say is unwitnessed pain, and there are symptoms from that, like hypervigilance, which is not forgetting, right? Is being hyper-aware of the situation or similar situation. 

That, we would say, is a normal response, and that isn’t about working through forgiveness. It’s the need to work through trauma to unlock the process of moving through forgiveness. And I just think the care and the need for hurt looks different for the care and processing through trauma, and it’s so hard when individuals want so badly to move through the process of forgiveness but keep getting hooked, not because they’re not working through it, not because the decisional piece isn’t there but the emotional piece and the trauma need extra care. Exactly.  

Yes. So, again, maybe it’s overly simplistic, Kaleb, but sometimes in this deep work of forgiveness that you find yourself where you know and your desire is to forgive but you find yourself continually stuck in actually moving towards the emotional piece might be a sign or a signal to deeper work that’s needed here. If it’s to release that, we hesitate to put a timeline, right? 

Because this process often does take years. It doesn’t happen overnight. But if it’s ongoing, again, we think of hypervigilance and negativity, I just think my encouragement is to learn about trauma and what it is so that we’re able to identify if you’re walking through trauma. Are these responses to trauma, or is this me just not able to let go of that? Yeah. Those are different pieces. Because it will take time. Again, this is just the hardness of this situation.  

It will take time, and you can just think if you’ve had an offense and you’ve ruminated on it, and you’ve recalled that and thought how hurtful that is 100 times. You’ve built a go-to pattern of thinking, whenever that comes up. So, there is an aspect of whether you’re going to replace that or hold onto the forgiveness or move to the emotional piece, it’s not going to probably be just one or two times of doing that. 

Yeah. You have to rework that system. Yeah. And the beautiful thing about our brains is that they are moldable. They are changeable. God has designed it in a way that they can rewire our default thinking patterns, and his grace is possible at any time, but it often takes relearning. So true. Let’s go into this last piece of reconciliation and just step into that because it just builds into this concept. But I think we can equate forgiveness and trusting or forgiveness, and everything is back to normal, right, to how it had been. And that piece over here, like trusting and everything back where that’s more reconciliation or relationship repair. 

Yeah. And it’s really two different things, right? So, I think it’s important for us just to have a distinction in our minds. Forgiveness is releasing what’s owed against us by those that have wronged against us definitionally. Where reconciliation is where two people take steps to rebuild a relationship that has been hurt. And there’s a place in the Scripture where Jesus is talking about if there’s an offense that happens if a person repents, then forgive them. Which can almost make it sound like forgiveness is conditional. I think probably a deeper reading of that Scripture would lean into this idea of reconciliation that forgiveness aspect there is a little bit of a deeper level of reconciled relationship and that becomes a little bit more dependent upon the other party. Reconciliation is dependent upon both parties being willing to step into it. 

For sure. Romans says, “If possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.” Yeah. There’s a condition there. For sure. Yeah, I think often of the story of Joseph. Yeah. And you see that process played out, that he had forgiven them, but he was not in a place of reconciling until they were at a place to reconcile. 

And so, one of the things that I often talk about with couples is the need for truth. And the truth then leads to relational safety which leads to the ability to rebuild trust and then have intimacy. 

So, this is an ongoing process. If there are two parties that don’t share the truth that this was a sin and this happened, then there’s no safety in the relationship. If those two parties don’t agree with the truth, as you were saying, one denies that or minimizes or does not own and takes responsibility for the sin that happened, the offense that happened, then you don’t have a shared truth. You can’t go to that next level of reconciliation. And I think the reality of the cross is that there is unlimited grace to forgive all. 

And there’s also the truth that provides us with parameters to say, “No, this is not okay. No, this is wrong.” Sometimes in these places, Arlan, the Scripture, “turn the other cheek” gets quoted. And I do think we have to be careful that’s about not retaliating. That’s not about us just allowing hurt to continue to happen. Sure. That we’re responsible for reconciliation. This is actually a two-way relationship. And so there is space for truth that leads to boundaries to prevent ongoing hurt when another party is not in the place to be able to seek reconciliation. 

So, it is a true statement that in some situations, unfortunately there will be broken trust. Relationships will not restore to where they were. But God’s heart is towards reconciliation. So, you have a little bit of a tension there where it’s dependent upon both parties being willing to come to the table. I think that’s the key. And even with Joseph, the example is that he had the heart and he longed to and wanted to, but there was also testing and a process that took place in order to make that happen. 

That wasn’t just dependent on Joseph. It was dependent on the relationship. And actually, the other one to be ready because I can’t force reconciliation. No. And I’ve heard it said that reconciliation is as possible as far as each party’s willing to move. Yeah. Because usually, you’re going to have both parties move somewhat. And again, it depends. Every situation probably has a uniqueness to it and who the offender was and the seriousness of the offense and that thing. But in the next slide here, you got some steps of reconciliation. 

Just some common steps to reconciliation. But the first step, if you’re the offender there’s repentance that has to happen. Where you have to honestly admit that there was wrong. You have to acknowledge the pain. And so, again, to some extent, reconciliation is only as possible as much as repentance is possible. And maybe it’s not fair to say. But sometimes it requires both parties but there might be different levels of seriousness on both sides, but both parties have to come to the table. 

For sure. Yeah. And have to be willing to admit whatever potentially, they may have done wrong. Because if there’s no repentance, then there’s no offense, right? Whenever there’s offense, even in Scripture, again, related to our relationship with God, He provided a way through which we could be forgiven. 

And the process of acknowledging wrong. And again, with Joseph, I think about the life of Joseph. You see Judah and others who were sorry they sold him. Yeah. And acknowledging that. Yeah. And so there was guilt for what I did wrong that then provided the way for restitution to happen. 

And so, Psalm 51 is a great example of when we’re in a relationship where there’s been wrong done, here are some key things to be aware of. Is the individual remorseful? Do they acknowledge, feel guilty for the sin? One, as it says here, restitution, right? They’re willing to step into the process of making it right. And then there’s a change of behavior. Rehabilitation may be necessary to provide assurance that there is changed behavior. Sometimes when there’s been deeply broken trust to know that there’s a pattern over time. Particularly in relationships where there’s been deep hurt, woundedness, trauma, we would say, there’s an ongoing change of behavior. Yeah. It’s not just, for two weeks I can play nice, but this is an ongoing pattern of changed behavior that’s rooted in, we would say, repentance. 

Yeah. So, part of what it seems that makes forgiveness so hard is that, again, God’s grace makes anything possible, and it can move fairly quickly, right? If there are willing parties and grace-filled parties. Depending on what it is. 

Type of thing. But normally, often though, it’s going to take time. And it’s going to be difficult, and it’s going to be ongoing. And to some extent, that’s not the society we live in. The society we live in likes instantaneousness and probably most of human nature doesn’t like to be wrong or doesn’t like to be told we’re wrong or whatever. 

Yeah. So, you’ve got a lot of things working against forgiveness and reconciliation. This whole process. This is not natural. Yeah. It needs the grace of God to work it through, but it’s probably why it’s so core to God’s being because He is a God of reconciliation. He’s a God of mercy. 

He’s a God that brings restitution in the midst of judgment. Yeah. And to see that not lived out in his people is so grievous to him. Sure. Yeah. Let’s talk about boundaries really quick. Boundaries came up in the, several of the questions. So, play out a situation where you have an offense that happened between two individuals. They see each other regularly, so you can’t avoid each other. And one party is trying to work through it. 

Maybe the other party’s oblivious or not aware or doesn’t seem to be repentant enough or whatever. How do you counsel people or encourage people around this idea of maybe boundaries or just setting up healthy relationship parameters? Is that the right way to say it? Yeah. So, I think first, maybe what do we mean by boundaries? Boundaries are not to control another person. They’re more about being in place so that it provides a way that healing can occur. Does that make sense? So, what is needed for continued healing to occur? 

And so related to this situation that you brought up, for the individual that has been offended that is dealing with the hurt, what are the sort of things that they need to be able to feel safe, to be able to continue to work through forgiveness in a healthy way? 

And it may mean that there are certain things that that they need. Times that they go to certain places, how they go, bringing someone with them. I’m trying to think of specific examples. But I think that the boundaries are put in place so that there’s not ongoing continued hurt. 

When there’s no remorse or repentance with the other parties. And so there is a time when it might be appropriate to have some spacing. For sure, just to keep the freshness from continuing on with that. Go ahead. Yeah. Okay. We’ve got a couple of questions pop in. Sure. I want to step into these a little bit that have been chatted in. So, one of these questions speaks to this idea of is there any way to help others heal their own broken heartedness so that they can in turn recognize that they are currently hurting others and how much God has forgiven them? 

So, you have a situation where perhaps someone doesn’t see the offense they are causing. Similar kinds of what we just were talking about a little bit. Is there anything that can be done to help someone else see how much hurt they are causing someone else? Yeah. 

Can I just provide a little clarification for that question? Sure. I think the question is you know the adage, hurt people hurt people. And some people don’t realize that they’re hurting people until they’ve processed how they’ve been hurt. And so, the question is a little bit how do you help people who are hurting others but it’s coming from a place of hurt? 

How do you help them deal with their own broken heartedness so that they might recognize that they are in turn hurting others? Yeah. Does that make sense? Yeah, it does. That’s tough. That is because my mind goes to a few different places. So, we don’t know the context of why they’re not able to see it, whether it’s a lack of insight, whether there are other factors at play for this individual, perhaps a deep trauma that they’re responding in ways that we would say are out of that kind of trauma. 

But the first thing that I think about in this question is the person open and willing to step into the process of discovering with you? That’s the first piece. I want to learn and I want to grow. But then I think if that’s not there sometimes it is healthy boundaries in a loving way that communicate the consequence of hurtful behavior. 

For us to lovingly set boundaries with someone who continues to wound us, but not in a reactive way, not in a vengeful way, but is helping the person come to the reality that life does not work like this. When you hurt somebody, there are consequences for that, and sometimes boundaries are the lesson that brings about an understanding and awareness of how much I’m hurting another person. I guess that’s where there could be a situation perhaps where that’s a hard conversation. Now, this would not be probably the person that’s deeply hurt themselves or the emotions have to be under control. But it also could be a situation where that hard conversation needs to be had with someone to sit down and say, “Can we talk about your behavior?” 

And can we talk through where you recognize or do you realize it? But you used the word process. That’s part of a process of the right way and the appropriate way and all those kinds of things, right? I would think so. 

I was just assuming from this question that they’re not getting it. They’re hurting other people, and they’re not realizing that they’re hurting other people, and that there’s been a conversation already. Yes. But if the conversation hasn’t happened, for sure, I think having a conversation in a curious, open way, would you be open to some perspective? Can we talk through this together? Yeah. Absolutely that would be the path. But then being able to step into the protective boundaries as an appropriate act of self-protection there, but there’s also a way to demonstrate and show love. 

Yeah, I think that’s helpful. The boundaries can help a person point to that matter. There’s another good question about trauma. Kaleb, you talked about how we can confuse lack of forgiveness to trauma triggering. So, the question is, how do we identify if we are suffering trauma versus not just letting go or giving grace? So, any other pointers help in sending a person in that direction? Yeah. So, the first thing I would just really encourage is learning about trauma. We have a lot of resources that teach about what trauma is and how it manifests itself. And one of the things I think we referenced with trauma is a book called The Body Keeps the Score, and actually the trauma overwhelms the system, the ability to cope, right? 

We’re not able to cope, and so the body takes over. And so, then there are symptoms like hypervigilance, which means I’m hyper aware of my environment that’s even close to what has happened when the offense or the hurt happened. So, there’s hypervigilance. There’s certainly emotional dysregulation, which is also part of trauma. There is a change of belief in having negative beliefs both about self and others that are result of that. And so, I guess without going on, my encouragement in that is to educate yourself about trauma and what trauma is. 

I think that would say, oh, is this something that is continually rooted in something that actually has to do with my nervous system needing support, maybe professional support to move through? Or is it if I’ve been on a journey already with the care and the processing of those who love me that I’m able to walk through it. 

So, I think that would be my initial thought. And I think perhaps you can correct me, but sometimes there’s self-learning and then just the openness or being willing to walk through what you’re experiencing, what you’re feeling with someone trained to do some discernment for you as well too. 

Yes. Because at some point there’s discernment that’s needed from the outside. Correct. If you’re really caught up in it. Yes. Professional counseling is certainly important. One of the things I think about as you’re talking about this is intrusive memory with trauma. One of the key factors, too, is what’s called intrusive memories or feelings or thoughts, they just come in uninvited. That’s very much different than me thinking about continuing to churn on the offense. Yeah. And so a different flavor says trauma needs professional help to move through forgiveness where the forgiveness part is about learning tools and ways to move through that.  

For sure. I see there’s one more question we have. We’re a little bit past the top of the hour, but just one more question here. How do you navigate a relationship with the party that does not acknowledge the truth of the hurt? Even when there’s been a third party involved perhaps to help with trying to encourage some of this, what would you recommend a path forward when the other party is family and there’s going to be a lot of interaction even in the midst of no engagement in the healing process? 

So, you have a family relationship, one party sees it and is hurt. The other party will not even acknowledge or even realize what’s going on. It looks like that first step of trying to bring some awareness has been taken. Again, is this a place where you have to think through that boundary discussion a little bit? 

Or are there other places, in a hard situation like this to go? That’s just so hard, Arlan. Even that question, right? We’re sitting here trying to respond to a question where clearly there’s been ongoing care from church leadership and so I think it feels ingenuous to try to answer this in a minute or two. But I do think where my mind goes is to boundaries. What does this look like? It sounds like this person is not at a place to engage the process, and I think the hard piece is we can’t make the other person see hurt. Yeah. But what we can do is through truth of Scripture, and it’s been clearly pointed out. The sin has been pointed out, and yet there hasn’t been change. One thing that comes to my mind is the hurt continuing to happen? Yeah. Is it continuing to go on? Because if that’s the case, then that’s a different discussion than if the hurt isn’t going on, but we’re still getting family gatherings. 

How do I go to a family gathering when this individual’s refusing to acknowledge the hurt? Yeah. And how do I work through that? That, to me, is a different kind of question, and I would approach it differently. Yeah. Whether it’s an ongoing thing or if it’s a thing that is in the past. Is that what you’re saying there? 

Yeah, the hurt continues to happen at family events, for example. Yeah. So, then there would be boundaries in place just to keep a perpetuating situation from going on. But there’s an element of acceptance here as well too when there’s any relationship rupture, especially. And then the closer the relationship the harder this is. In a family dynamic, right? But it, it happens. In Joseph’s story there was a relationship rupture. There is an aspect of where acceptance has to come into the discussion as well too. To accept that, as hard as it is, things might not ever be back to the way they were. 

Correct. Yeah. Joseph and his brothers were never the same as they were before. Even though there was some level of reconciliation that took place. Sometimes as much as lieth in you. There is an acceptance that says, this is the reality that now is. 

And how do I live in that reality rightly? Which is so hard. It is so hard. Absolutely so hard. But it’s part of the echoing of the broken world that we live in. Yeah. And the relationship ruptures that can happen. And the healing can take place and the forgiveness. 

Yeah. Excellent questions and I think they just echo and point out the difficulty of the situation we find ourselves in with this topic. But let’s leave in a place of hope. Yeah. To realize as much as lieth in you, we can live peaceably with all men, and that forgiveness is possible through the vertical forgiveness that we have in God through Christ. Which brings us to a place of importance but then also brings us to a place of hope. For sure. Yep. Any thoughts? That was my response. You stepped right into it. I think being able to see in light of the reality of forgiveness is the hope that we have. 

Because of the forgiveness we’ve received, and that this is a process that is empowered in cooperation with the Holy Spirit to walk through the brokenness. And we hold on to that forgiveness, and we hold on to the examples that are out there of where God is a God of reconciliation. He’s a God of restoration that brings beauty out of ashes. Yeah. And that’s possible as we lean into this idea of forgiveness. Yeah. Thanks so much for being here. Yeah. Thanks for sharing your time with us today. And we pray that this teaching, this encouragement can be a blessing. 

There are a few resources at the end that speak into different aspects of this topic more deeply, and you’ll find those linked on our website where this recording will reside. And we pray that the God of restoration can be a God of healing as we walk through this life. 

Thank you and God bless.