Escaping the Drama Trap Podcast Episode

I think in my first 29 and a half years of my service in school, Matt, it was always like, oh, drama. You’ve got to be kidding me. I’m so sick and tired of this. But then it was like, wait a second. They’re trying to solve a problem, and I can take away all those other things. But at the core, they’re really trying to solve a problem, and it’s like, Craig, step into that and use the teachable moments there. 

Filter out all the other goofy stuff but actually see if you can get them to get to a teachable moment. Because they really are at heart trying to solve something. Well, you know, Craig, not only as a counselor here at ACCFS, but also as our boots on the ground clinician in the public schools, you have worked a career in the junior high setting as a counselor. 

Yes. Craig and I like to talk shop, here in the office, and often I’m asking Craig, what have you been learning? And as is often the case, he’ll bring a topic that is very germane to the junior high setting. And I think I’m safe from it, you know, because I’m so wise and mature. 

And then all of a sudden, I find out that, oh, I haven’t matured beyond a seventh grader. Yes, this still applies to me. That happens every now and then, Matt, doesn’t it? So, today’s topic might not be any different. The topic is drama, and this is something that you brought up. Hey, we could talk about drama, something that you probably don’t experience in the school setting. 

Right. That’s why I brought it up. The entertainment industry has made a mint on drama. Yeah. It’s a genre, right? Let’s go back to Shakespeare. Yeah. So, drama has long entertained people. If it wasn’t just on the screen or in books, it has to be in life too, doesn’t it? 

Yeah. It really is. And even in my lens of the 12, 13, 14-year-old, right, like you said in that wise chair, we can stereotypically just make fun of the kids, it’s all about drama to them. Right? And we can just leave it there. But there’s really a lot more behind it, isn’t there? 

There is and it strikes very close to home because the subject matter might change, the impetus might change, but the drama is ever so present. And I do think this is a good topic to have a conversation about because we all have drama in our life. How do we respond to that drama? How do we relate to that drama? 

How do we think through it? How might we be contributing to it in unhealthy or healthy ways? I think these are all good things to think about. Yeah. I think it’s one of those topics that it’s easy to throw stones at. Yeah. But if we stop and realize, well, my house has some glass in it, I better be a bit cautious with that. 

So, I think it’s a good topic to talk through. Yeah, it is, and one of those topics, like a lot of topics, where it’s easy to see how other people contribute to drama, but not me. You know, I don’t, yeah. Well, anyway, let’s get in. Let’s start with the definition. That’s always a good place to start. 

When we think of drama, what do you think of? Yeah, well, Matt, just looking at that definition piece, the state, the situation or series of events involving interesting or intense conflict of forces. I see that when there’s something going on between a couple kids or a group of kids, and in their attempt to solve it or to find some type of solution or answer, they then kick in the set of behaviors. And that’s often trying to get somewhere, but it’s often as a result of a conflict that’s occurring. Yeah, what I heard, and then you just repeat it as conflict. That seems to be the seed to drama, isn’t it? 

Whether it’s a conflict, a power conflict, whether there’s emotional conflict, physical conflict. Yeah. Okay. Well let’s just play this on for size. Okay. All right. You’re in a school setting. Okay, Craig, and I shout peace, peace, peace. Are people going to respond to that? Or if I shout fight, fight, fight, which one of those will empty the classrooms into the hallway, Craig? 

Yes. Yeah, not the peaceful one, sadly. No, but it’s conflict, isn’t it? Yeah. We actually find conflict interesting. Now, what are the ill effects of this interest? Conflict? Well, I think the ill effect is one that draws us away from responding how Jesus would want us to respond and treat one another. 

I think another ill effect, Matt, is we get really good at what we do a lot of, and some people who get really good at stepping into drama or a conflict that whether they think people need advice or not, they’re stepping into that. If we do that often, I think that’s an ill effect. I see that in the sense of certain kids at school, and you just shake your head and it’s like you, again, you find your way in all of these things and it’s like they do a lot of it and they get really good at it. 

Okay. Well, my children are rolling their eyes right now. Okay. Because very often I will say. Did you not know that wasn’t going to be helpful? You know what I mean? Yeah. Like, did you seriously not read the room to know that comment wasn’t going to be helpful? But you know what? Sometimes we really do know it’s not going to be helpful, and that’s why we do it. 

Yeah. Right? Yeah. And that’s really what you’re speaking of is that there is a tendency to fuel. Because of the previously laid out axiom. We much prefer to watch conflict than peace. And so, I like that word, that fueling piece. And, the reward, what’s in it in that sense. 

And you just look at the dynamics of people stepping into that. And one, it’s like, hey, I want to look big here. I want to be a big person on campus, and I want this attention. So, I’m stepping into that because it gives me attention, it gives me focus. For some, I think they just operate under their emotions, and their emotion is just like there’s a storm coming and they have to let the lightning and the thunder, and the rain come down. And so, it’s like this expression coming out of them of what’s just been building up on the inside of them as another piece.  

You’ve predicted my question, and you’ve really laid out two basic elements that drama plays on. One is attention and the other one is emotion. Absolutely. You know, I think of that second one, emotion. What is a drama story without emotion? It just falls flat. Yeah. And so, going back to your idea of fuel, emotion really fuels drama. 

Am I right? Yeah. Especially the parts of it that aren’t leading to anything productive or helpful. The raw emotion that just keeps escalating just keeps creating more and more poor choices, it seems. Right. Well, which is all often what we see, and I’m going to be very clever and say we see in kids, wink, wink because adults don’t do this. 

But what we see in kids very often is they love to get that rise out of the other one. Right. And that’s actually the play in the playbook, you pull the kid aside and say, hey listen, don’t you know that they’re trying to get a reaction out of you? Yeah. Like if you just didn’t get emotional, it would all go away. Yeah. But it’s too hard not to get emotional and then it fuels the drama. Right. Oh, wow. And now we’ll pan back to US adults and nod, right? Yeah. A phrase that I’ve used a lot in that conversation or realm with a student. And I’ll stop and I’ll say, who do you want to be in control of your emotions and thoughts? 

And they’re like, well, I want to be. And I said, do you know that you’ve given that control to that other kid because they have you so worked up, so upset that you’ve actually given up the control of your thoughts and feelings to that other kid. I said, who do you want to be in control? And they’re like, well, I want to be in control. 

And I’m like, who’s the best person to be in control of your thoughts and emotions? And they’re like, yeah, it’s me. And we can have that conversation. And it sounds like an element. So, is there an element here in this element of drama, of trying to control others? As opposed to controlling ourselves. 

Is there an imbalance of control put in the wrong place? Yeah. What are some other elements that you would say? Elements that maybe fuel drama. Certainly, in that sense, situations are questionable. Those situations that are like you said, exciting to the senses. As you said, people aren’t going to be too excited to check out two students who are studying really hard for a math test. 

Let’s go down and look at that. We don’t care about that, but if there’s something that’s in the sense of maybe naughty or outside the norm or that could just be challenging in that sense, I think that’s a huge draw for our senses in that. But even that, Craig, is playing on an audience. Yeah. 

That’s playing on an audience. Yeah. Right. You are really saying those are the things that draw an audience, and so there is fuel to drama that is audience driven. Yeah. Right. As I mentioned, the fight, fight, fight, scene, everybody comes out, there’s an audience there, and then it becomes performance. 

Yeah. So, drama quickly turns into performance. Yeah, because it’s fueled by audience. Take away the audience. That’s the number one thing that teachers are taught. If there’s a scuffle in the hallway, get people to walk the other direction and it will go away. Right. I think how big that is, even in our culture. 

Yeah. Matt, I mean, take away the audience. Oh yeah. What would even be the motivation for people to engage or to write magazines or produce whatever, to create that conflict that we just love to be able to watch and see. If there’s no audience, why would they have even been doing that? 

And that’s the genius behind the genre. Yeah. Right? Yeah. I mean, Shakespeare knew it and still today, drama grabs a great audience. Yeah. I think something that’s woven in this is that the gossip and talking about other people really is this sidecar to the drama dynamic. 

Interesting. Would you say that produces sides? So, who’s on whose side type of thing. Yeah. Is that part of the talk? Yeah. You talk about a crowd or players coming together, right? And at some point, someone needs to speak into that and then so what are they speaking into? 

And that piece of sharing stuff about someone else or, hey, did you know that so and so said this about you? So, you have to secure your side. Yeah. Not only is there an audience that fuels it, but you often try to secure allegiances in your side, and that’s part of the underpinnings of drama. 

Yeah. And the person that gets more people on their side, the better they are and the more correct they are. You never saw that in the school system, did you? A few times. So, what did you do? One of the things is awareness, right? You always try to increase awareness. And in those groups of people saying and positioning, sometimes we lose clarity, and we lose sight of what is really going on. And so usually try to bring up awareness and just by asking, so what is going on? What do you see that’s going on? Trying to check for clarification. Sometimes students are focused on one thing and they’re really actually missing that there are other things that play in that. Okay? So, drama can get our eyes off the ball as well as embellish things and see things that are not really there. Is that a true statement. Yeah. And often if you’re navigating into that world, you’re not actually caring too much about whether things are correct. 

It’s about the fuel. And so, sadly we can get caught up in things that aren’t really very accurate, but it certainly is fueling the fire. Craig, it takes so much self-control and security not to require an audience, not to require a side, and to be completely objective in ourselves in moments like this. 

Right. Yeah. So, the tendency and the temptation to over exaggerate or to understate our offense and overstate another person’s offense is just really easy to do, isn’t it? Yeah. I think of the word justice. There’s this justice component that’s wrapped into this conflict and, you know, there needs to be justice, and some person has to be held accountable for what they’re doing. 

And so, there’s a wrong and a right and there are lots of little judges who want to put in their sentencing on what they think should happen to the people who are in this conflict. And it just comes so easy to speak into those things. So, you help them understand, maybe see the clearer picture, maybe see a bigger picture. Maybe see the picture more accurately than what they are allowing themselves. Yeah. Anything else? Yeah. And then step back and to say okay, you know, the Bible so beautifully reminds us to check our heart. What is the nature of our heart? What is coming out of my heart? And then try to ask them to say, okay, is there something else that’s going on? 

Is there a root behind this? Is this another person? Is this the first time? And so, I try to check and see if there’s maybe something else that’s been going on. And this is what the focus is. This is what the drama of the day is. But there might be something under the hood. 

And if you can pull the poison out and draw that out, then the drama can take care of itself. Or it doesn’t have legs to stand on anymore. Yeah. And asking someone, what do you want to accomplish with this? You’re worked up. They’re worked up. What are your goals? You got people mad, what are your goals? 

What do you want out of this? And sometimes, I think drama takes this life form of itself and we just are caught in it and it swirls in and out and when you actually stop and say, so what do you really want out of this? It’s sometimes interesting. You get either I want the other person to pay or to suffer or to hurt or I’m not sure what started all this. Yeah. I don’t even know right now. Well that first one you mentioned, the fear of losing is really difficult to overcome. It seems like there’s a saving of face that both sides need to be able to come to in order for it to settle agreeably.  

Am I right? Yeah. I think in my first 29 and a half years of service in the school, Matt, it was always like, oh, drama. You’ve got to be kidding me. I’m so sick and tired of this. But then it was like, wait a second, they’re trying to solve a problem, and I can take away all those other things. But at the core, they’re really trying to solve a problem. And it’s like, Craig, step into that and use the teachable moments there. Filter out all the other goofy stuff but actually see if you can get them to a teachable moment. Because they really are trying to solve something. 

Yeah. Sometimes we don’t see ourselves well, Craig. I’ve made that admission already that this is as much as I’d like to think it’s a seventh-grade problem. Yes. It’s not. No, it’s near what indicators might say that I might be a person who instigates drama in unnecessary and unwanted ways. 

Great question in that, Matt. I think it really connects into that core and need for relationships and being understood or being valued and being heard. And I think the absence of that then creates a void. And so, I’m looking for areas in that and sometimes there’s maybe some insecurity, those types of things that run along those lines. 

Yeah. I also think on the other side of that, like I said, people who have learned to use words as currency and to build their relationships. I think for some there’s a natural piece to be significant and drama is a way to step in and to have something to say. 

And that definitely feeds into that. Well, it definitely absorbs power. Yeah. Drama is very power inducing, and it is one way that we do absorb power and that’s certainly a human tendency. Yeah. And I talked about the problem-solving thing, and so I think sometimes if we step into that with adult feet, it can be like, hey, these people over here are doing this wrong and I have a solution, or my idea for them to fix that is really the right one. And so, I want to engage two other people who are maybe just on their own navigating things, and I want to come in and present to them how we solve that. And so, sometimes that’s well received and sometimes there’s a biblical moment for that. 

Sometimes it can just really be, oh, another person is jumping in, which now creates the need to take sides, and then other people get involved and then all of a sudden, it’s just flooded out. Yeah. You know what, I love that idea of problem solving and then as you describe other people get involved and it gets muddy. 

There is this element when things turn personal. Then things go off the rails pretty quick. And so, as I listen to you explain the plan or the problem solving, I hear objectivity, I hear rational thought. There’s something to say about blurring the lines of taking things personal and taking things and being objective about them. 

It seems to me that when things go personal, drama explodes. Yeah. It’s hard not to go personal. Yeah. Yeah. That’s like my default setting, Matt. Yeah. It goes personal first and then I have to work my way up out of that basement and say, okay, wait a second. Now let’s stop and think about this for a moment. 

So right there is an important skill set. Working your way out of it being personal. A saying I heard a long time ago, right? Garbage in, garbage out. So, what comes in then comes out. But then also bringing in wisdom, to have wise understanding, wise responses, wise thoughts. Thinking through things enough to know what I’m going to say with this. 

And, you know, the Bible gives us great encouragement on what to do with our words and how to use our words and when to use our words and to have thought through that so we’re not just always reacting on an impulse. What do I want to stand on? In situations like this, I think it is a good place to start. I love that. Yeah, Craig. Now the heartburn with that good advice is, it sounds slow. Wisdom is usually paced and it’s measured. It’s slow and it waits. And drama calls for all the opposite. Yes. It calls for quick. It calls for now. Yeah. It calls for elevation. 

Yeah. There’s nothing about drama that says. Slow down and breathe. Yes. So, those are competing. What you’ve just explained, I have to do in order for things not to be personal. But to be rational and objective is in direct opposition to what my flesh is going to want to do, which is going to induce drama. 

Right. So that ability to manage or recognize or regulate our emotions really is a piece of what we get to do in this as well. So that, I think, is a huge tip. Being able to regulate your emotions is important in order to step into drama and to navigate it well. Yeah. Okay. Now here’s another observation. 

When we don’t regulate emotion, that is one way we gather up power. You can get a person’s attention by raising your voice. Right. Anger gets people’s attention. But you’re really calling for emotional regulation that doesn’t grab the upper hand by the easy way of emotion.  

Yeah. And that just requires a giant of a person. And so, now for seventh graders to have a struggle with this is pretty reasonable I would think. Right? Because as adults as a 46-year-old, that’s a challenge. Yeah. And to appreciate that. 

You know, we look at how God created and designed us, and some people think their way through things and to other people that emotion element is so engaging and rich and beautiful in that sense, and their ability to express and know emotion. 

But we have to know ourselves. Where do I come from? Which angle, which side, which continuum do I regulate from? I’m so glad that you said that, Craig, because emotion is beautiful and even anger and justice have their place. But we need to know how to steward those things. Yeah. And sometimes drama can make the worst of it. 

Yeah. It’s like that fast on switch to emotion to your emotional library. Drama and conflict have people invested and engaged and picking sides. It is such a fast switch to emotions. Craig, we’ve talked about drama. We’ve talked about the ill effects we’ve talked about what drama plays on and how I might know if I induce drama. 

Yeah. How do I calm drama? Maybe we are in a situation drama is maybe a point or two on. How do we calm it? Yeah. Well, I think as we look horizontally at people, it is a great reminder to look vertically and to just whisper a prayer to say, Lord, this is tough right now. I ask for wisdom and to be willing to go vertically and just ask for some wisdom. Then to be able to do that oil check of where’s my emotion right now? If I feel it coming up in me, to stop for a moment and calm myself and be able to say, I feel my heart rate going up a bit. And so, taking a moment and doing a check to see where I am with my emotions in that sense of what’s happening there. I think another piece is what is my message right now? Do I feel like I have to be right? And do I have to be heard at the expense of everyone else that’s there? 

And I think that’s a good check to say oh, okay, less words for a moment. I can step back and just go quietly. That soft answer turns away wrath, and I can step back into that too. I really appreciate that. You’ve given us a couple of directions. First is that upward direction where we have fellowship and audience with God, and if we have something to say, we can have it out with him. 

And sometimes, that’s what we need to do. But to have that security in that direction often means we need less of other people, which is partly what got us into this jam. Then you mentioned knowing ourselves really well. What I heard about that is slowing down and being really self-aware and doing good, self-aware work. Yeah. Knowing our shadows. Knowing that this is when I act poorly. These are the situations where I really act poorly. And sometimes knowing that when walking into a situation is really helpful, isn’t it? So helpful.  

And then finally, you talk about that messaging, which is that horizontal going out to other people and being thoughtful about that message. And even as you were saying that, Matt, I can think of things that I’ve said quickly that seemed like they were great things to say. Yeah. Only to regret them later. Yeah. That was not the right thing to say. And as we know, once they’re said, they’re difficult to retrieve. But the point is really as James talks about the weapon of the tongue. 

Right. It’s at a crisis in moments of drama, isn’t it? Yeah. And we get the blessing of the other side of that then is that we also get to extend grace and you know what? People are going to say and do things, like you said, but we get to extend grace as well. And may that be an encouragement. Let’s end with that. 

Craig, thank you so much. Thanks for sharing your wisdom coming out of junior high that applies to adults all too closely. But the point that you just made there at the end, that there’s always repair that can be done. To step into that, to come back to a person even years later and say, you know what, I’d like to clear this up. 

There’s wonderful repair and redemption, and that’s what Christ longs to do. Even in these places of high drama. Thanks. Thanks for being on. Thanks everyone for listening. Maybe you can’t relate to drama. Maybe you don’t have any in your life, but I’m guessing that you probably do, and I hope today’s topic was helpful. 

God bless you, each one.