Spiritual Growth Mindset Podcast Episode

Yeah. I mean, think about kids. Once in a while, they go through these growth spurts, right? And they’re feeling these pains and all these things, and you put their pants on and suddenly it’s like these things are too short. And that’s what it is, you put on something old, and it doesn’t fit anymore. 

Right. Welcome everyone to Breaking Bread the podcast brought to you by Apostolic Christian Counseling and Family Services. Terrific as always to have you along. Matt Kaufmann is my name. Arlan Miller and Isaac Funk are with me and we’re going to talk about spiritual growth. Isaac, as we talk about spiritual growth there are lots of synonyms to that concept, but flesh that out. When we talk about spiritual growth, what do we mean?  

Yeah, when I think about spiritual growth, I think about having a goal set before me. And my goal as a Christian is to be like my Master, to be like my Lord Jesus. And so, my growth spiritually to become as he is, is quite a long distance between how I find myself to be now and who I see Jesus to be through the Scriptures. 

And spiritual growth is the journey of shortening that ever present gap. Exactly. Right. That’s really helpful in spiritual growth. And so, we’re joining spiritual growth and growth mindset to be spiritual growth mindset. Some people do have a growth mindset. Some people don’t have a growth mindset. 

Arlan, growth mindset, you can even put your teacher hat on, right? That was a major topic as we thought about students in the classroom. You’re exactly right, Matt. I mean, a growth mindset has this connotation with it that says we’re moving towards something versus being static, right? And so, if you have a student or if you have a child, we want to see them moving along. 

We don’t want them staying put or being stationary. There’s a mindset that says there’s a place to go and we are going to head towards that place. I think where the tricky thing comes in is part of the mindset of, well, how quickly should that happen or how does that happen? What is the mindset that goes along with it? 

Is it a marathon mindset that means this is going to be methodical and take time and progress is going to be measured in smaller buckets? Or is it like this instantaneous sprint type mindset that says, you know, we should be able to flip a switch and things are changed and you can see how culture has kind of spoken into that. 

Sure. And so, I want to just pull apart these two very key ideas that you’ve given. One is that improvement is possible and I’m not static in my location. I run up against that as a math teacher all the time. This is all I can do. Yeah. Right. Teacher, this is all I can do. And we want them to have a growth mindset to say, no, actually you can do more and learn more. 

So, there’s a static mindset or a growth mindset. And then you also overlaid it with this element of rate. Is it instantaneous growth or very rapid growth, or is it slow growth? So, Isaac, now let’s go back to spiritual growth, the spiritual growth mindset. As you engage with people in the discipleship space, how important is this idea of a spiritual growth mindset? Speak to these elements that Arlan has brought up. Yeah, well, just to tie it right in with that, I remember when I was teaching in elementary school, some program with a Yeti-like character came in, I can’t remember the name of the program now, and it was like the power of Yeti. 

And it was like, I can’t do something yet. Right. That was kind of the message. Oh, I’m trying to learn to tie my shoes. Well, here’s how you tie your shoes. Go ahead and do that. Oh, I can’t tie my shoes. So, you can’t tie your shoes yet. There’s a process of learning that’s going to happen. And so, when it comes to our spiritual growth, Jesus really puts the bar high for us in the Gospels of what kind of lives we ought to be living, what it’s like to live in his kingdom, and how do we demonstrate that on earth. 

And so, he says things like, take no thought for tomorrow, or don’t worry. And I think most people today probably hear this command of Jesus, and he says, don’t worry, and then we go off and the next daily anxiety comes up in our life, and where do we find ourselves? We’re worrying. It’s not as easy as just flipping a switch. 

Oh, something comes my way and now I can just suddenly act as Jesus would have me act. There is a process of learning how to do the things that Jesus commands us to do. And that journey of learning is spiritual growth. So, the mindset is Jesus asks me to do a lot of things and he set the bar really high for me. 

I cannot do them at the outset. I must grow in my learning and my ability to actually live out. Well, Arlan, you raised this idea of expectation being a thing. If you expect quick change and don’t get quick change, then that’s unsettling. Well, we all want change to happen quickly. I think we as Christians believe that change should be quicker than most. 

All things are made new, we read in the Scriptures. I am a believer. I’ve repented of my sin. Why do I still struggle with this vice? Why am I still tempted by this thing? Why do I still find Bible reading difficult? You know, what is wrong with my conversion that is still yielding this fruit that I know should be done away with? 

And to add on to that, we hear beautiful testimony of the person who says, I repented and never once had a craving for a smoke. And another person says, not a day goes by that I don’t crave it. What’s wrong with me? And so, we also have beautiful testimony, which I want to give credence to. I think all of us, as Christians have a testimony of a beautiful change that came without notice and perhaps without a great deal of elbow grease, and then other things that just seem a grind. Yeah. And I think you said it exactly right. We hear enough testimonies, which are powerful, that we start to think as we compare ourselves or whatever we might do, that, oh, it should be easier for me, or I should have been able to overcome this by now. 

And those testimonies can be motivational, they should be motivational, but they can’t be prescriptive. If they did it, then I should do it, or it should look just like that for me. And there’s an element of where it really pushes us towards faith and pushes us towards perseverance to where we say, okay, I believe the power of the Scriptures and the promises of Christ. 

He says that he will continue the work in me until the day of Jesus, right? He’s begun a good work and will continue it until the day of Jesus, but that’s going to look differently for me than for you, Matt, or for you, Isaac. It’s going to look like a little bit different path. And that’s okay. It’s about the direction. 

Are we moving towards growth, or do we get into a place where we kind of give up or get static or whatever? That’s where the trouble starts to come in. That’s helpful. That he would continue the work until the day of Jesus Christ, I think is an excellent Scripture to think about and to bring up as we think about spiritual growth, because I think it challenges an assumption that we have about growth. If I think of a growth period, I think about young people. They’re growing their brains, they’re growing their bodies, they’re growing their businesses. Young people grow. But I think what you are saying, which I think is really, really important, the mindset that when we talk about spiritual growth, we’re talking about every human being and a person in their middle age is just as in need of spiritual growth as an early convert. 

There do seem to be matters and issues and questions that a believer in various stages of life is answering and growing in and being cognizant of that I think is really, really helpful. Yeah, I just heard a beautiful testimony of a young person, and they gave an example to your point, Matt. And the example was something that we would almost gloss over if we were not careful. 

And they talked about friendships at school at that junior high, high school age. And they said it used to be, I found that I wanted to only be with the popular kids. And now I find that I’m thinking about all the others who are on the outside looking in and see how that behavior change showed a complete and radical mindset shift within the person from inward to outward. 

That very Christlike outward thinking about those who are on the outside looking in has to sometimes be teased out in us or else we just gloss over it, but it’s what we celebrate. Well, we have to celebrate that there is growth taking place. Now as time goes on and we’re dealing with these hard inner things of identity and whatever, to your earlier point Isaac, it gets more lost in that slow grind of change, but the process hasn’t necessarily shifted. 

Christ is shifting us from ourselves to him, and that’s the beautiful thing. Yeah, and that disclaimer is always going to be important, like you’ve already said. The journey looks different for everybody on some level. There are always going to be differences, but there are also, I think, some similarities. 

There is a shape, generally, to this spiritual growth. I think actually one thing that can be very helpful is when others are engaged in the growth process with us, or we might be engaged in the spiritual growth mindset with someone else because sometimes we can’t see it in ourselves. We can’t see those slow, steady changes that are taking place, but you ask someone else who knows you well or who has walked through life with you, that’s the opportunity to encourage and say, you know what, I have seen great growth. 

You might not be feeling it. Things have not turned the way you thought they were going to. It has not been as quick as you had wanted it to be. But I want you to be encouraged because I have seen change take place that can only be attributed to God and his grace working in you. That’s a beautiful opportunity as helpers of others to support them in that spiritual growth mindset. 

We get blinded to ourselves if we’re just left to ourselves. I think that’s the nature of growth. You don’t see things changing. Yeah. I mean, think about kids. Once in a while, they go through these growth spurts and they’re feeling these pains and all these things. And you put their pants on and suddenly it’s like, these things are too short. 

Right. And that’s what it is. You put on something old, you know, like it doesn’t fit anymore. Right. I was perfectly happy to walk in this pair of pants for years of my life and then I hit. a growth spurt or whatever. And I put on the pants again and man, these feel uncomfortable. 

It doesn’t feel like they’re my pants anymore. They just aren’t fitting. And so, in the spiritual life, there are ways of living in which we’ve walked for quite some time. And then over time, as we grow, we find that way of living just doesn’t fit anymore. It’s not fitting my paradigm for life with Jesus. It’s not fitting even my desires and affections, which have been molded over time to become more like Jesus.  

I love it. It’s really good. It’s a great analogy. But a person might have a way that they speak to people, for example, and they might go back to that way whether it’s in an arrogant tone or a forceful, unloving way. And they might come to realize this isn’t right anymore. This doesn’t even feel like it’s me. I’m growing out of this. This is something to be celebrated. I think to your point, as a pair of pants that doesn’t fit needs to go away. And that is a marker of spiritual growth. Yeah. Totally.  

What once suited me, was giving pleasure to me, whatever, is no longer doing that. Scriptures speak to this idea too. One that comes to mind initially is in Ephesians 4 where Paul’s talking to the Christians there in Ephesus. He’s contrasting the life of those around them who are living in godless ways with how they ought to be living in their new life with Christ. 

He says you need to put off your old way of living so that you can put on your new way of living. But here’s what was fresh to me. I have often read that Scripture and thought, okay, what do I need to be putting off? But the way that that story was shared as I spiritually grow, it will become apparent what needs to be put off because they don’t fit right anymore. 

And I think that’s an important mind shift as well, that spiritual growth prompts action and further spiritual growth. It begets itself in that way. He’s turning us into new creatures. And so, the work is deep because he’s really getting at the core parts of you. And you just don’t have immediate access to those by the nature that God has designed. And so, it will take time for him to form those deepest parts of you into something brand new.  

So, you’re saying God is good with time. He’s good with time. God is good with a long time? He’s good with a long time, but he also rejoices, and we should rejoice, with every step forward. You’ve heard this quote before probably, but you know, every father is ecstatic with a child’s first wobbly step, but he’s never satisfied until he has a full measured gate, right? 

So, God is easily pleased, but never satisfied. And that’s an aspect of this growth that we celebrate. And we are excited, and we are thankful for every small step of growth in the right direction. God has all the time in the world and all the resources to accomplish what he wants to accomplish in us. 

Our job is just to make ourselves available to him in our lives and he’ll do that work in us over time. What is our disposition? What do we do and not do in this spiritual growth journey? Well, I think of other Christian writers very long ago who would make a big point about, you know, you don’t need to work yourself up over your own life. 

Like, don’t freak out. You did what you did because how could you do anything other than that? And being who you are in this moment. You need Jesus to save you and to form you. And the first thing I’d say is don’t try to work yourself up into a tizzy about your failures. We’ve all got failures. Identify what those things are. Find the things that will help you to change that, spiritual disciplines for most, if not all of us. And we have a lot of resources and conversations about those things. And then you start to apply those things in a way that opens you up to the Spirit’s work in you, knowing that it is God who has begun the work in you, and it is God who will see it through. 

And I think to that point in this conversation, this disposition, there’s an element of making God big. He is able. It is he that worketh in you both to will and to do his good pleasure. Lean into him and turn towards him in all those things. That’s always a step in that direction. I think with that, we’ll bring this to a close. 

You get down on eye level to any six-year-old and say, you’re getting so big and their eyes will light up. Children want to grow. They’ve got growth markers, perhaps on a doorpost at the house, right? They’re looking forward to every single inch. The growth mindset of a child is so incredibly healthy. They understand that they’re not as tall as they want to be and perhaps what they are going to be, and they cheer the whole process along. 

And I think there’s really something to glean from that, that we don’t lose it because some of us are old, but we still are not browbeaten by the growth that needs to happen. The child is not, they just hasten for it. And I think that’s a beautiful disposition, beautiful mindset that we all can have, right? 

Who is God creating us and growing us into becoming? That person is so exciting. That’s our hope we have in Christ and the Spirit’s work. So, thanks both of you for helping in this conversation, really highlighting tremendous truths. Bless you. And to each one who’s listened to this podcast, I hope it’s been helpful.